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Star Wars Episode VI: Return of the Jedi (1983)
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Bud Brewster
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2017 10:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gord Green wrote:
And like Dorian Grey's portrait, the dissolute, diseased man with the corrupted soul was revealed for what he had become, reduced to a creature more to be pitied than feared.

The Dark Side had leeched the humanity from him and when he turned, at the last, to the Light Side, what may have looked like your examples above had the evil lifted from him.

He said to Luke "Let me look at you with my own eyes..." indicating that Vader was no more. He was once again Anakin.

Wow, that's persuasive and well-worded rebuttal, Obi-wan Greenobi! It makes perfect sense. Very Happy

If Palpatine could go from a normal man to the hideous countenance shown below in few seconds just because he completely surrendered to the full "force" of the Dark Side, your suggestion that Anakin might have physically changed when he renounced the Dark Side and pitched Palpatine down the reactor shaft is very reasonable.

Even though I can't help feeling disappointed at the wimpy look of "Vader Unmasked", in view of your excellent arguments I'm forced to concede the debate. Very Happy




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Gord Green
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2017 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you, Sir.

The Palpatine / Emperor physical change brought on by the Dark side was what set me to thinking.

Actually, we are BOTH correct. When he was consumed by the Dark side he looked like your examples, we just never got to see that. It would have been good if we had at least more than a glimpse so the return to the light would have been more obvious.

But, after all, isn't examination, discussion leading to understanding the reason for myth and legend?
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Bud Brewster
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2017 6:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gord Green wrote:
When he was consumed by the Dark side he looked like your examples, we just never got to see that. It would have been good if we had at least more than a glimpse so the return to the light would have been more obvious.

An excellent point!

I submit that Anakin's physical deterioration occurred slowly over the years, hidden by the helmet (which also hide his horribly injured flesh).

The reason I've always disliked the scene in which Palpatine became an "instant Evil Emperor" in Revenge of Sith is that I assumed his horrible appearance in Return of the Jedi was a slow process caused by his exposure to the Dark Side for many years — like the deteriorating appearance of a drug addict.

Your interpretation of the scene in Revenge of the Sith suggests that Palpatine had embraced the Dark Side so completely he was able to fully utilize all its evil power in one devastating moment, giving him the ability to unleash those lightning bolts against poor Mace Windu. But by doing so he paid a terrible price, turning himself in the hideous creature he became in a matter of seconds!

Anakin was also well on his way to that level of commitment, but he wasn't there yet. In fact, we never saw him use the lightning bolt power, even when he chose to save his tortured son from the Emperor, who unleashed the full power of his own frightening abilities.

However, it seems reasonable to assume that Darth Vader's 20 year exposure to the evil of the Dark Side would cause his physical appearance to deteriorate. It's difficult to imagine what Vader really looked like under that helmet — a hideous combination of scar tissue after his burned flesh healed, plus the ravages of his long exposure to the Dark Side!

When all these factors are taken into consideration, I guess Darth Dumpty actually looked pretty good by the time he was finally unveiled by his forgiving son when Luke provided a chance for Vader ask for his forgiveness.

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~ The Space Children (1958)


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Bud Brewster
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PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2017 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

________________________________

IMDB has 245 trivia items for this movie. Here's a few of the most interesting ones.
________________________________

According to Gary Kurtz, the original treatment ended with Luke Skywalker walking off alone and exhausted like the hero in a Spaghetti Western, going into seclusion by walking out into the Tatooine desert. George Lucas opted for a happier ending to encourage higher merchandise sales.

Note from me: George was right, the happy ending is what the fans wanted after the Empire is defeated. Bus it's ironic that The Force Awakens uses the idea of Luke going into seclusion.

The Endor shots were filmed near Crescent City, California. Forest work was especially hard on the Ewok actors. Production Assistant Ian Bryce arrived on the set one day to find a note from the Ewok actors saying that they had all had enough and they were on their way to the airport. Bryce tried to drive to the airport, but got a flat tire not far from the set. He found another car and was about to leave when the Ewoks' bus pulled up, and all the Ewok actors got off wearing "Revenge of the Ewok" t-shirts.

Note from me: Oh my God! I'd love to have a picture of this priceless moment! Very Happy

Hayden Christensen mentioned in an interview that he didn't fully know what George Lucas was up to when he was inserted into The Special Edition, otherwise he would have played the scene totally different.

Note from me: Oh for Pete's sake! All the guy had to do was smile at Luke! How would he "play the scene different"? Maybe he could have smiled and winked and then said, "Hey, Luke! Who's your Daddy now, eh?" Rolling Eyes

John Williams son Joseph Williams, the lead singer of the pop/rock band Toto, collaborated on part of the score, and wrote lyrics for the Ewoks songs.

Note from me: I like both the original Ewok celebration song and the beautiful John Williams music that replaced it. And I also like Toto's hit, 99 . . . which, according to Wikipedia, "was written as a tribute to George Lucas' film THX 1138 and the music video resembles a scene in the movie."

Wow . . . who knew, eh? Shocked


____________ TOTO ☆ 99 (official music video)

__________


According to Ian McDiarmid in the Blu-ray commentary, Palpatine is over 100 years old.

Note from me: When I first saw Palpatine in Return of the Jedi, I assumed he was either very old (but kept alive by the Dark Side of the Force), or middle-aged and horribly deformed by the corrosive effect of using the Dark Side for several decades. In fact, all the way back to A New Hope I thought poor Anakin Skywalker was corrupted by the "drug" of the Dark Side in a similar manner.

For these reasons, I hated the scene in Revenge of the Sith when Palpatine uses Dark Force lightening on Sam L. Jackson and instantly goes from fleshy grape to shriveled raisin faster than you can say "I Heard it Through the Grapevine"!

I mean . . . damn! Suddenly Palpatine looked like the Prune from Hell, and Anakin is on his knees begging this instant villain to be his Force boy-toy!

None of these characters became who they were in the manner I predicted! It sucked!


__________________ Mace Windu Vs Palpatine

__________


Alan Rickman auditioned for the role of Moff Jerjerrod.

Note from me: That would have actually worked! Very Happy

On what was dubbed "Black Friday", 100,000 feet of film stock containing effects shots that couldn't be read in an optical printer were unceremoniously dumped by George Lucas himself. The crew at ILM were forced to go back to the drawing board and start again from scratch, with many getting drunk when they heard the news.

Note from me: Gosh, and we all thought that film making was just non-stop glitz, glamour, and glory! Who knew it sometimes involved moments of extreme anguish and complete inebriation!
Sad
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Maurice
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PostPosted: Sat May 27, 2017 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bullshit on the 100,000 feet of film. In 35mm film terms that would be 18.5 hours of footage. Even if that was all Vistavision 8-perf footage that's 9.25 hours.
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Bud Brewster
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2018 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

________________________________

I posted a fan-made trailer for The Last Starfighter (1984) on the thread for that movie, and the trailer had this amusing message at the beginning.






I wondered just how true the claim at the bottom was, so I made a list of 1980s science fiction films that I thought were good, just to see if that decade really did produce a significant number of “the best” sci-fi movies.

This movie is on the list I made. I know what I like about the film (and a few things I don’t like), but I’d like to hear the pros and cons from the rest of you folks.

So, what do you think, guys? Cool

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Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958)
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Bud Brewster
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 10:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

__________


Enjoy this well-written Starlog article from issue 80.

Click on each page here to see a large, easy-to-read version you can zoom in on. Click on the large version again, and then zoom in as close as you want!










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Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958)
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Bud Brewster
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 11:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

__________


Here's part 2 of the above Starlog article from issue 82.

Click on each page here to see a large, easy-to-read version you can zoom in on. Click on the large version again, and then zoom in as close as you want!










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Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958)
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Bud Brewster
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

_______________________________

It’s interesting to read articles about the heroic efforts that were made by FX people back in the age of models and bluescreens and motion controlled cameras. Much of that kind of effects work is now gone in the age of CGI, just like stop motion became just as extinct as the dinosaurs it once brought life.

This article renewed my appreciation for the hard work needed to create those cinematic masterpieces “the hard way” back in the latter decades of the 20th century.

I was amazed at how much luck and personal skill was involved in combiniing multiple pieces of film to build up a scene like (for example) the shot of all those ships zooming around in front of the Deathstar in Return of the Jedi. That shot require 70 separate elements (strips of film). Small adjustments had to be made in the positions of individual element to make it work.

It was insanely difficult. God bless CGI! It has probably saved the sanity of many a FX person. Shocked

The article mentions how much trouble the FX people had with what should have been a simple shot: the cockpit POV scenes of the stolen shuttle Tydirium passing close by Darth Vader’s Super-Star Destroyer on it’s way to Endor. They couldn’t get it right for some reason because “the angles weren’t right”.

Oddly enough, I know exactly what shot the article refers to, and I noticed that the shot didn’t look right the first time I saw the movie! Watch the scene in the clip below and notice how the backside of the Super-Star Destroyer’s bridge when viewed through the shuttle’s canopy doesn’t look like it’s just sliding past the shuttle, it also looks like it’s rotating clockwise!






[//size][size=18]This article is packed with interesting facts about the challenges and hardships the FX guys experienced during the making of this movie. I highly recommend that you guys enjoy this great article. Very Happy

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Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958)


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Bogmeister
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2019 5:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

____________



The 2nd sequel to Star Wars (77) after The Empire Strikes Back (1980) and the 6th chapter of the film series (George Lucas intended it to be a 6-part saga, so this one would have been the final chapter, but the 7th chapter finally arrives in 2015).

The first act finds our heroes back on Tatooine, in the domain of Jabba the Hut, the local head gangster who looks like a giant slug. Han Solo (Harrison Ford) had been captured and frozen near the end of the 5th episode — so now, about a year later — his friends have figured out a plan to rescue him.

It's a strange, 2-pronged plan; both Leia (Carrie Fisher) and Lando (Billy Dee Williams) infiltrate Jabba's organization but Leia is swiftly found out and made Jabba's pet slave. It then falls to Luke (Mark Hamill), now well-versed in the ways of "The Force," to directly challenge Jabba's authority. This act also features the bounty hunter Boba Fett (Jeremy Bulloch) in action.



As first acts go, the entire sequence is fairly entertaining, perhaps more-than-ever a big budget variation of old-fashioned action serials.

But it may also be a sad commentary that the FX puppet playing Jabba probably remains the most entertaining character of the film; he or it is a cheerful expression of larger-than-life villainy — again, straight out of the old serials — and you may be almost sad to see him go so early in the film.

After Han's rescue, the film switches gears to get on with the business of the rebellion. Luke briefly returns to Dagobah to witness Yoda's death and then joins everyone in the latest plan against the Empire — which has an oddly deja vu feeling about it: the rebels need to destroy a 2nd version of the Death Star, shown as under construction. The difference with this is that the Emperor (Ian McDiarmid) himself has arrived to join Darth Vader on the Death Star, which orbits the forested moon of Endor.

____________________

It's in this big forest that the real drawbacks of the film begin. We are soon introduced to the local residents, small teddy bear characters called Ewoks. The film, until now appropriate for young teens and people of all ages, suddenly becomes geared towards 10-year-olds and younger.

This was the latest bid of George Lucas to expand the merchandising potential, i.e. sell more toys to the kids. It's also what prevents this film series from reaching truly classic status.

The Ewoks capture Leia first and then the other heroes, but are cowed when Luke levitates C3PO, whom the little creatures regard as a godling. From then on, the Ewoks becomes serious allies of the rebels in defeating the Imperial troops.

Isn't that magnificent?

No, not so, because all the scenes of the Ewoks are too sharp a contrast with the dark tone of the Emperor's scenes with Vader and Luke. It's almost like watching two different films.



Where the film does excel — and this makes it similar to late scenes in The Empire Strikes Back — is in concluding the story arc of Luke and Vader, with the Emperor thrown in to offer a truly creepy portrait of rancid evil. In showing us this Emperor, the film underlines what the menace of this Empire really is and what power Vader has been following over the course of these films.

McDiarmid was an inspired choice to play the dark ruler — he reeks of evil and his voice is most unsettling. His backstory was, of course, later revealed in the prequels, but this was at the time — 1983 — our only glimpse of this terrible figure and it was unpleasantly intense, also piquing our curiosity about who this Satanic villain really was and where he came from. There was a further revelation about Luke and Leia, settling things for the Luke-Leia-Han triangle, and an unexpected finale for Vader.

Return of the Trivia: As with the previous two films, this was the highest-grossing film of the year (1983).

~ Actor McDiarmid would reprise his role in the prequels, even though he was over 15 years older when the prequels were made and his character — only then named Palpatine — was over 20 years younger.

~ In the 2004 video release version of this film, actor Hayden Christensen was inserted digitally in the final shot as a ghostly Anakin; before, it was actor Sebastian Shaw as an older Anakin. The next episode, VII, to be released in 2015, takes place about 30 years after the events here.


_________ Star Wars- Return Of The Jedi Trailer

__________


BoG's Score: 7.5 out of 10



BoG
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Eadie
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2019 10:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's NOT funny, fellas!


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Pow
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2021 12:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We could have had another ending entirely to this movie.

George Lucas originally suggested to co-writer Lawrence Kasdan that Luke Skywalker should turn evil after removing Darth Vader's helmet. Kasdan loved it.

"Now I am Vader" would have been Luke's line.

Luke would then make it his mission to destroy the Rebel fleet.

Mark Hamill pushed for this ending.

And Harrison Ford pushed for Han Solo to die fighting for the Rebels on the planet Endor.
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Gord Green
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2021 1:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
George Lucas originally suggested to co-writer Lawrence Kasdan that Luke Skywalker should turn evil after removing Darth Vader's helmet. Kasdan loved it.

"Now I am Vader" would have been Luke's line.


This would have been a TERRIBLE ending for Return of the Jedi .

However, It would have made a perfect story for SW7-9! In a way, some of the idea was teased with. My understanding of the original Lucas plan was for Luke to slide toward the Dark side and Leia to be the "other" that saves him just as he had their father. This was hinted at in Luke's vision in Yoda's tree/cave in EMPIRE.

Ah well....So much for roads not taken.

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johnnybear
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 13, 2021 9:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Emperor as originally seen in Return of The Jedi was shown to be an ugly rippled, purple skinned monster without explanation but when they decided to do the prequels they rehired the same actor, Ian McDiarmid as Palpatine so they didn't want a monster as depicted in the later film so they made him human norm. But later they decided to fill in all the gaps and show Palpatine actually morph into the ugly Emperor as seen in the later film! I agree his monstrous appearance might have been better explained away as his devotion to the Dark Side destroying the cells in his body over the years but they knew most people watching wouldn't understand that theory!
JB
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Bud Brewster
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 13, 2021 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

johnnybear wrote:
I agree his monstrous appearance might have been better explained away as his devotion to the Dark Side destroying the cells in his body over the years but they knew most people watching wouldn't understand that theory!
JB

Johnny, you are dead right when you said that Palpatine's degeneration should have occurred over the twenty-year period between the time we last saw him in Revenge of the Sith until we first see the aged, ugly version in Return of the Jedi.

I immediately disliked the scene in which Palpatine morphed in seconds to the old version. That's just one of several key plot elements in Revenge of the Sith that I feel were mistakes. It's a very flawed movie, in my opinion.
Sad
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