![ALL SCI-FI Forum Index](templates/subSilver/images/logo_phpBB.gif) |
ALL SCI-FI Nothin' but pure science fiction!
|
View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
Maurice Mission Specialist
![](images/avatars/10462730105ca2a190ed4b9.jpg)
Joined: 14 Dec 2013 Posts: 485 Location: 3rd Rock
|
Posted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 3:34 am Post subject: |
|
|
I didn't buy it being from 1956 because the airbrush paint style feels 1980s. So I did some Googling, and on this site (link) found this article from The Wall Street Journal dated Sept 24, 1989 which specifically mentions that ad.
Here's the specific reference:
Jim Beam print ads, however, strike different chords in different countries.
In Australia, land of the outback, a snapshot of Jim Beam lies on a strip of hand-tooled leather. West Germans get glitz, with bourbon in the foreground and a posh Beverly Hills hotel in the background.
Ads for England are artsy and irreverent. One ad features a huge robot carrying a voluptuous woman in a faint.
The tagline: "I only asked if she wanted a Jim Beam."
See also this page about Robby the Pitchbot.
In short, I suggest not jumping to conclusions about the age and authenticity of stuff. ![Smile](images/smiles/icon_smile.gif) _________________ * * *
"The absence of limitations is the enemy of art."
― Orson Welles |
|
Back to top |
|
![](templates/subSilver/images/spacer.gif) |
Bud Brewster Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)
![](images/avatars/3.jpg)
Joined: 14 Dec 2013 Posts: 17175 Location: North Carolina
|
Posted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:45 pm Post subject: |
|
|
________________________________
Please forgive me, Maurice, but I couldn't resist downloading the beautiful version of the magazine ad you found and using Paint.net to remove that horrible fold in the middle, along with adjusting the viewing angle to correct for the fact that it was laying on a table and slightly distorted.
I knew it would look great at the top of your post right next to your avatar! Unfortunately the comparison of the two points out the fact the artist reversed Robby's spinning "ear rings".
Actually, the original poster artist did the same thing.
Here's the original, with the link to your larger version embedded. (By the way, the link to the Wall Street Journal doesn't seem to work.)
![](https://i.imgur.com/HTwHqwA.jpg) _________________ ____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958)
Last edited by Bud Brewster on Tue Jun 18, 2019 10:56 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
Back to top |
|
![](templates/subSilver/images/spacer.gif) |
Maurice Mission Specialist
![](images/avatars/10462730105ca2a190ed4b9.jpg)
Joined: 14 Dec 2013 Posts: 485 Location: 3rd Rock
|
Posted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 5:31 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Weird, because that link opens fine for me. It's not a secure link, though, so some web browsers might balk at it.
The full text of the article isn't that interesting, but I'm a stickler for providing citations and sources to show I've got the facts straight. ![Smile](images/smiles/icon_smile.gif) _________________ * * *
"The absence of limitations is the enemy of art."
― Orson Welles |
|
Back to top |
|
![](templates/subSilver/images/spacer.gif) |
Bud Brewster Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)
![](images/avatars/3.jpg)
Joined: 14 Dec 2013 Posts: 17175 Location: North Carolina
|
Posted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 7:07 pm Post subject: |
|
|
________________________________
Maurice, I admire you dedication to citing sources, and we appreciate that you do that.
I wonder why that link doesn't work for me Unfortunately, this is what I get when I click on it with Firefox. This is a screen shot.
![](https://i.imgur.com/0YsOXvY.png) _________________ ____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958) |
|
Back to top |
|
![](templates/subSilver/images/spacer.gif) |
Robert (Butch) Day Galactic Ambassador
![](http://i.imgur.com/SZEPb5X.jpg)
Joined: 19 Sep 2014 Posts: 1437 Location: Arlington, WA USA
|
Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 8:15 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Hmmm, Interesting!
I received the Bonhams Auction Catalog for May 14, 2019 and contacted Bonhamd about it (I didn't order it).
It was sent to me courtesy of TCM of which am a member. They also answered a number of questions. On;y the original Robby & jeep were Bill Malone; all other Forbidden Planet memorabilia were from the collection of Wes Shank (who owned the 20" saucer) and the blue prints were the ones cleaned up for the Cinefantastique double issue (some not used). Te original house blueprints consisted of 7 sheets and the lab set blueprints consisted of 22 sheets; Bil Malone still owns the originals. I sure would like to have copies of them to scan and post! _________________ Common Sense ISN'T Common |
|
Back to top |
|
![](templates/subSilver/images/spacer.gif) |
Krel Guest
|
Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 10:45 am Post subject: |
|
|
You hear about the small and large saucer miniatures, but is the location of the medium size, 44 inch known?
David. |
|
Back to top |
|
![](templates/subSilver/images/spacer.gif) |
Robert (Butch) Day Galactic Ambassador
![](http://i.imgur.com/SZEPb5X.jpg)
Joined: 19 Sep 2014 Posts: 1437 Location: Arlington, WA USA
|
Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 1:31 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Bill Malone owns it. Somewhere there is a photo of Bill & I holding it, it was very heavy (about 85 - 100 pounds). [It was used by Fred Barton as a mold for the ones he sells.] I'll ask Eadie to find the picture and post it. _________________ Common Sense ISN'T Common |
|
Back to top |
|
![](templates/subSilver/images/spacer.gif) |
Robert (Butch) Day Galactic Ambassador
![](http://i.imgur.com/SZEPb5X.jpg)
Joined: 19 Sep 2014 Posts: 1437 Location: Arlington, WA USA
|
Posted: Fri Jun 28, 2019 5:43 pm Post subject: |
|
|
A fan painting titled Eclipse by W. Ostrow:
When I saw many movies as a kid these were the prices of rickets:
"Road-show" attractions (The Ten Commandments) were $1.25 from the opening of the theater to 2:00 PM, $2.50 in the afternoon and $3.75 in the evening after 5:00 PM. "Special" movies (Around the World in 80 Days) were around $5.00.
This shows why theaters relied on the snack bars and why so many movies ended up on TV and for rental.
Anyone else remember this? _________________ Common Sense ISN'T Common |
|
Back to top |
|
![](templates/subSilver/images/spacer.gif) |
Bud Brewster Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)
![](images/avatars/3.jpg)
Joined: 14 Dec 2013 Posts: 17175 Location: North Carolina
|
Posted: Fri Jun 28, 2019 6:50 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Robert (Butch) Day wrote: | Bill Malone owns it. Somewhere there is a photo of Bill & I holding it, it was very heavy (about 85 - 100 pounds). [It was used by Fred Barton as a mold for the ones he sells.] I'll ask Eadie to find the picture and post it. |
I haven't gotten an answer yet, but I sent Bill Malone a Facebook message asking him if he currently or had ever owned the 44" saucer miniature. I hope you find that picture of you and Bill holding the saucer soon, Butch, so I can send it to him.
He might need it to jog his memory.
Previous messages to Bill about your claims concerning a close relationship haven't resulted in verification . . . as I've mention to you on several occasions.
Butch, I'm just gently reminding you of your promise to me concerning the need to get your facts straight when posting on All Sci-Fi. That photo would set my mind at ease. I hope you find it soon. ![Wink](images/smiles/icon_wink.gif) _________________ ____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958) |
|
Back to top |
|
![](templates/subSilver/images/spacer.gif) |
Robert (Butch) Day Galactic Ambassador
![](http://i.imgur.com/SZEPb5X.jpg)
Joined: 19 Sep 2014 Posts: 1437 Location: Arlington, WA USA
|
Posted: Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:40 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Despite everything that happens, Robby Carries On!
![](https://i.imgur.com/5GUyy8v.jpg) _________________ Common Sense ISN'T Common |
|
Back to top |
|
![](templates/subSilver/images/spacer.gif) |
Robert (Butch) Day Galactic Ambassador
![](http://i.imgur.com/SZEPb5X.jpg)
Joined: 19 Sep 2014 Posts: 1437 Location: Arlington, WA USA
|
Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 4:11 am Post subject: |
|
|
As for the picture of the 44 inch sacer, I'll have to wait for Eadie to return from"Karloffornia", then after the 4th of July as she is going to Vancouver, B. C. Canada on July 1st to visit her aunt for Canada Day to scan and post it.
* * * * * * * * * *
This is where to download a "pdf" file of the October 1967 reprint of the original novelization
https://epdf.pub/forbidden-planet.html
This is the complete cast & credits made from the 1956 Motion Pictures Yearbook. It has lots of information not found anywhere else!
Cast
Edward Morbius, PhD, DLitt played by Walter Pidgeon
Altaira Morbius played by Anne Francis
Commander John Justin Adams played by Leslie Nielsen
Robby the Robot played by Marvin Miller (Voice, uncredited), Frankie Darro (uncredited), Frankie Carpenter (uncredited)
Lieutenant Charles Xavier Ostrow, MD played by Warren Stevens
Lieutenant Gerald Percival Farman played by Jack Kelly
Chief Warrant Officer Alonzo Quinn played by Richard Anderson
Crewman James “Cookie” Dirocco played by Earl Holliman
Chief Petty Officer (Bosun) Steven Todd played by George Dewey Wallace
Crewman Robert Grey played by Bob Dix
Crewman William Youngerford played by Jimmy Thompson
Crewman Joe Strong played by James Drury
Crewman Michael “Gabby” Randall played by Harry Harvey, Jr.
Crewman Peter Lindstrom played by Roger McGee
Crewman Albert Moran played by Peter Miller
Crewman Ralph Lindstrom played by Morgan Jones
Crewman Art Silvers played by Richard Grant (uncredited)
Crewman Frank Starza played by William Boyett (uncredited)
Crewman Stuart Nevski played by James Best
Narrator Les Tremayne
Crewman # 11 Eddie Fisher [uncredited]
Crewman # 12 Frankie Darro [uncredited]
Crewman # 13 Frankie Carpenter [uncredited]
Crewman # 14 Robert J. Wilkes [stunt man #1
–crushed by Id]
Crewman # 15 Dick Crockett [stunt man #2
– knocked aside by Id]
Crewman # 16 Gene Dynarski [stunt man #3
- lifted in air by Id, Jack Kelly’s stand-in]
Crew
Office Department
M-G-M Studio Chief Dore Schary
M-G-M Executive Producer Joseph J. Cohn
Produced by Nicholas Nayfack
Production Manager David Freeman
Legal Counsel Rudy Monte
Production Department
Directed by Fred McLeod Wilcox
Assisstant Director George Rhein
Screenplay by Cyril Hume
Based upon the story FATAL PLANET by Irving Block and Allen Adler
Suggested by THE TEMPEST by William Shakespeare
Novelization by W. J. Stuart (Phillip McDonald, With Assistance From Robert A. Heinlein)
Read the Novel Published by Harper & Rowe in Hardback and Bantam Books in Paperback
Senior Stagehand Jim McClennan
Camera Department
Cinematography by George J. Folsey, Jr.
Film Editor Ferris Webster
Cinemascope™ Lenses by Bausch & Lomb
Color Consultant Charles K. Hagedorn
Matte Photography by Warren Newcombe
Matte Photography Editor Ben Fugelsby
Matte Effects First Cameraman Marc M. Davis (Through Courtesy of Walt Disney Productions)
Matte Effects Second Cameraman Dick Worsfield
Optical Photography Irving G. Ries
Process Photography Harold Lipstein
Spaceship Interior Effects Photography Harold Mazoratti
Spaceship Miniature Photography Max Fabian
Krell Shaft Miniature Photography Harold Wellman
Animation Photography Art Cruickshank (Through Courtesy of 20th Century-Fox Productions)
Wardrobe Department
Miss Francis’ Costumes by Helen Rose
Men’s Costumes by Walter Plunkett
Senior Costumer Tommy James
Make-Up Department
Make-Up by William Tuttle
Hair Stylist Sydney Guilaroff
Sound Department
Sound Recording Supervisor Dr. Wesley C. Miller.
Recorded in Sterophonic Sound on the RCA Stereophonic Four Track Magnetic Sound System. Certain Prints Use The Perspecta™ Sound System.
Music Department
Electronic Tonalities by Louis and Charlotte (Bebe) Barron
Music Supervisor Johnny Green
Musical Score by David Rose (Used in Trailers only)
Art Department
Art Direction Cedric Gibbons
Production Design Arthur Lonergan
Conceptual Visualization Irving Block
Production Illustrator Mentor C. Huebner
Set Decoration Hugh Hunt, Edwin B. Willis
Scenic Designs George Gibson,Harrt Tepler
Scenic Painters Clark Provins, Ed Helms, Leo Atkinson, William H. Gibbins, Tommy Duff, Arthur Rider, Bob Woolfe and Bob Overbeck and Bill Smart
Paint Mixer F. Wayne Hill
Matte Paintings by Henri Hillinck, Howard Fisher and Mathew Yuricich
Sculptures by Sascha Brastoff
Furniture Designed by Charles Ormond Eames, Jr. and Ray-Bernice Alexandra Kaiser Eames
Drafting Department
Senior Draftsman Lewis Barnette
Chief Draftsman, Robby Robert Kinoshita
Draftsman, Morbius Residence Howard Sturge
Draftsman, Krell Laboratory Marvin Connell
Draftsman, Cruiser C-57-D Irwin Barnette
Draftsman, Cyclorama Ben Carre
Draftsman, Tractor Louis DeWitt
Draftsman, Robby's Vehicle George Kleine
Special Effects Department
Special Effects Supervisor Albert Arnold Gillespie
Mechanical Effects Glen Robinson
Property Master Jack Gaylord
Chief Property Technician Max Gerbinger
Property Technicians Cliff Grant, Andy Thatcher, Rudy Spangler and Eddie Fisher
Property Electricians Jack McMasters and Bob McDonald
Altair IV Globe Colin Lowe
Set Miniatures Constructed by Paul Jarhaus
Miniature Effects Chief Mechanic Glen Robinson
Miniature Effects Mechanical Assisstant Joe Zomar
Miniature Effects Mechanical Technicians Alfred D. Flowers, Logan Frazee and Dean Pearson
Miniature Effects Chief Electrician Jack McMasters
Miniature Effects Electrical Consultant Earl McCoy
Miniature Effects Assisstant Electricians Chuck Frazier, Dion Hanson and Eddie Fisher
Spaceship Miniatures Constructed by Floyd Parrish
Greensman Alfred D. Flowers
Animation Department (Through Courtesy of Walt Disney Productions)
Animator Joshua Meador
Assisstant Animator Dwight Carlisle
Inbetweener Joe Alves
Creature Design Kent Hultgren
© MCMLVI by Loews, Inc.
137 Minutes 16 Seconds (Original Print)
99 Minutes (Released Unfinished Work Print) 6 Reels in Cinemascope™ and Eastmancolor™
Trade Screen Showing Saturday, March 8, 1956
Released Wednesday, March 14, 1956
Budget $1,250,000.00
Cost $1,960,000.00
Earnings on First Run $4,780,000.00
The Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Science A. M. P. A. S. (“Oscar”) Awards Nominations:
Class III Technical Award for Innovative Visual Design [Technical Award]
Class III Technical Award for Innovative Musical Score [Technical Award] Best Visual Effects
A. M. P. A. S. (“Oscar”) Awards Won:
Class III Technical Award for Innovative Visual Design
Class III Technical Award for Innovative Musical Score
(Lost Best Visual Effects to THE TEN COMMANDMENTS - ‘Pilar of Fire’, by Joshua Meador)
© & ™ 1956 Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer™ and Loews, Inc™.
VHS Release © & ™ 1972 MGM/UA, Inc.
DVD Release © & ™ 1980 Turner Communications, Inc–.
HD-DVD Release © &™ 1989 Warner Communications, Inc™.
Blu-Ray Release © &™ 1996 Warner Communications, Inc™.
50th Anniversary Release © &™ 2006 Warner Communications, Inc™.
* * * * * * * * * *
If the gang wants I can post the February 14, 1954 script by Cyril Hume. If so I will have to do so in at least 6 parts. Its quite lengthy with the formatting. _________________ Common Sense ISN'T Common |
|
Back to top |
|
![](templates/subSilver/images/spacer.gif) |
Gord Green Galactic Ambassador
![](images/avatars/42.jpg)
Joined: 06 Oct 2014 Posts: 2945 Location: Buffalo, NY
|
Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:49 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I have the script dated 9/3/54 so yours may be an earlier draft. I'd love to see it!
Also, the earliest document may be the screen treatment for Cyrl Hume's FATAL PLANET. Would like to see that too if any copies still exist. _________________ There comes a time, thief, when gold loses its lustre, and the gems cease to sparkle, and the throne room becomes a prison; and all that is left is a father's love for his child. |
|
Back to top |
|
![](templates/subSilver/images/spacer.gif) |
Bud Brewster Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)
![](images/avatars/3.jpg)
Joined: 14 Dec 2013 Posts: 17175 Location: North Carolina
|
Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:49 pm Post subject: |
|
|
________________________________
Well, well — Butch really earned his Atta Boy for this month!_
The link to the novel provides a crystal clear version of each page, and after reading a short section from the first chapter, I've already learned something startling!
As we all know, the movie presents it's own version of "faster than light" travel by telling us in the opening narration that the C-57-D was "now more than a year out from Earth base . . . "
And Morbius tells Adams that if he is taken back to Earth for questioning, he'll be "two years or more away from my work" (the round trip time between Altair 4 and Earth).
Later, Adams tells Altaira that he and his crew have been "cooped up in hyperspace for 378 days."
Based on all this, the movie is saying that about one year passed during the trip for both the ship's crew AND for the normal universe. No "time dilation" for the crew.
Bear in mind that we can't criticize this as "scientifically inaccurate", because fast-then-light travel is theoretically impossible, so in the FP universe there IS a way to traveling faster than light, and that means our current laws were found to be faulty. (You can't break one rule and insist that the other rules still apply.)
However, the novel has this to say about the trip time to Altair 4.
________________________________
CHAPTER ONE - Major (Medical) G. X. Ostrow
Well, I'd asked for it hard enough — so it wasn't any good wishing I hadn't. But all the same, I couldn't help it. I wished I was anywhere except in this metal box, this huge oddly shaped shell which felt motionless as a mountain but was really hurtling across Nothing at more than the speed of light.
More than the speed of light! More than six hundred million terrestrial miles an hour!
At the beginning of the trip I used to find myself writing down that figure all the time — a six and then eight neat little zeros. But it didn't help. Although I knew it was true, my mind couldn't really accept it.
It was different for the other men, of course. They were used to it, used to the thought of it. Except for one or two old space-sweats who'd reached the age of thirty, they were all kids to me. Being over forty myself, I hadn't been reared to the idea of the QG drive. When I was their age speed was measured in thousands of m.p.h. and we never thought our lifetime would see Man breaking out of the Solar system.
More than six hundred million miles an hour! I knew I'd never get my mind to stop reeling at the thought of it. Or at some of its sequelae either.
Take what they call the 'time-squeeze' for instance. The kids knew — they automatically accepted — that while time is fixed at each end of one of these preposterous journeys, it is concertina'ed on the journey itself. I didn't know it; my mind kept rebelling against it. Not being a mathematician, I couldn't help regarding it as some sort of infuriating conjuring trick.
John Adams had told me (and I'd checked with Quinn) that the 'squeeze' on this journey, which would be about a year for us, was in ten to one ratio. I'd smiled at them politely, and thanked them for the information — but my mind still boggled at the thought that even if we just reached our destination and went straight back to Earth, I'd only have spent twenty-four months on the round trip but all my friends would be twenty years older.
________________________________
So, according to the novel the C-57-D will return to Earth twenty years after it left for Altair 4, not just two years! Good lord, I like the movie version of this idea better!
This certainly can't be the way we're supposed to understand the way hyperdrive works when we watch this movie. For one thing, the movie establishes that the Bellerophon landed twenty years earlier. Within one year of that date Altaira was born.
She was about twenty years old when the C-57-D arrived, after traveling one year.
But if things happened as the novel describes them, the Bellerophon would have spent ten years getting to Altaira 4, and it would have taken another ten years to return. Remember, they were described as "a prospecting party of scientists", not colonist who came to stay permanently.
Sending a rescue ship for the Bellerophon when they had only been gone twenty years seems odd. After all, according to the novel this rescue ship left ten years prior to the time it arrives at Altair 4.
What this means is that the rescue ship might be arriving at Altair 4 just about the time Bellerphon was arriving back on Earth! They would have passed each other going in opposite directions. Oops! :oop:
But lets assume the Bellerophon was equipped with the kind of transmitter the C-57-D was going to use to "report back to Earth base for special instructions," (Adam's words).
And let's further assume that Earth became concerned when the Bellerophon either never made a report, or it stopped reporting when (for example) the Id monster damaged the ship's equipment like it did to the C-57-D's transmitter.
If that's the case, then Earth sent out a rescue ship not long after the last transmission was received (if there were any), and this caused nineteen men to spend twenty years of their lives making the round trip to Altair 4 . . . when the absence of the transmission might have just been caused by equipment failure!
Nope, I contend that the movie's version of the events makes a lot more sense. The Bellerophon spent a year getting to Altair 4, and Earth waited twenty years before finally deciding that the scientists were stranded and needed help.
Finally, there's this: Altair 4 is about 16 light years from Earth, so the Bellerophon and the C-57-D must have traveled about 16 times the speed of light if the trip time was made in one year.
On the other hand, if it takes the C-57-D ten years to get to Altair 4, it's cruising speed is only 1.6 time the speed of light!
And yet the opening narration says "By 2200 AD [mankind] reached the other planets of our solar system. Almost at once there followed the discovery of hyperdrive, through with the speed of light was first obtained, and later greatly surpassed."
I don't consider 1.6 times the speed of light to qualify as "greatly surpassing" light speed. And I used this conversion chart to find what percentage of light speed 600,000,000 miles per hour (the ship's speed according to Doc).
The answers puzzles me. It's just 0.89 of light speed. A pokey 89%. Did W.J. Stuart gets his facts wrong? At that speed it would take the C-57-D about 20 years to reach Altair 4, not just ten.
Ladies and gentlemen, this novel is certainly going to give us a lot to discuss! ![Shocked](images/smiles/icon_eek.gif) _________________ ____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958) |
|
Back to top |
|
![](templates/subSilver/images/spacer.gif) |
Robert (Butch) Day Galactic Ambassador
![](http://i.imgur.com/SZEPb5X.jpg)
Joined: 19 Sep 2014 Posts: 1437 Location: Arlington, WA USA
|
Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 5:42 am Post subject: |
|
|
I hope everyone enjoyed the novelization.
I have just completed scanning the February 14, 1954 first draft script. Now I have to clean up the screenshots then post them. (332 screenshots).
After that I will do the same for the August 26, 1954 second draft script. I expect that this will be about the same size.
After clean-up I expect they will be 1/3 in number less each.
I hope these will be appreciated. _________________ Common Sense ISN'T Common |
|
Back to top |
|
![](templates/subSilver/images/spacer.gif) |
Danilo Junior Crewman
Joined: 02 Dec 2014 Posts: 8
|
Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 10:01 am Post subject: From 137 minutes to around 99 minutes |
|
|
137 Minutes 16 Seconds (Original Print) ?
So they cut a lot! Around 38 minutes! |
|
Back to top |
|
![](templates/subSilver/images/spacer.gif) |
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|