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Bud Brewster Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)

Joined: 14 Dec 2013 Posts: 17637 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Wed Aug 23, 2023 11:21 pm Post subject: |
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Maurice wrote: | Disney mostly shot on twos, too, Bud. |
Maurice, please clarify something.
Does "mostly" mean — "The later films which came after the classics in the 40s and early 50s?"
If so, I apologize if I didn't make it clear in my post above that I meant "the ater Disney movies were shot on twos, but the first few classic moves were shot on ones."
Emma Taggart, the author of the article at Linearty — which I based my comment on — made the statement shown below.
Please note the bold-faced text, which is the way it appears in her article.
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Animation is a complex process that requires imagination, skill, and patience. In the case of early Disney movies such as Snow White (1937) and Fantasia (1940), each frame was drawn by hand by an animator in a traditional studio.
This is mind-boggling when you consider that most Disney movies are made at 24 frames per second — that’s 24 individual drawings for each second of footage!
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I also found an article called Infrequently Asked Questions: How does 2-D animation work? on a site called Phllly Voice.
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An animator will draw individual images in a series, and then those images are strung together and run at 24 frames per second. The eye basically sees those frames move so fast that it interprets it as motion. That’s how you go from 2-D still image to a 2-D [motion image].
Isn’t that a lot of work to get that many frames in a second?
It is!
Disney started with 24 frames per second – they started with 24 frames of individual drawings per second. TV usually uses "animating on twos" and they animate at 12 frames per second. Each screen is on the frame a few times to make up the 24 frames per second. _________________ ____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958) |
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Maurice Starship Navigator

Joined: 14 Dec 2013 Posts: 542 Location: 3rd Rock
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Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2023 1:49 am Post subject: |
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Bud Brewster wrote: | Maurice wrote: | Disney mostly shot on twos, too, Bud. |
Maurice, please clarify something.
Does "mostly" mean — "The later films which came after the classics in the 40s and early 50s?" |
The problem comes with finding generalized info and nothing specific to a given film.
In traditional cel animation, how long each drawing was held was spelled out on the exposure sheets (aka X-sheets, also known as "dope sheets") for each shot, and that rate was typically twos except for fast action, which was shot on ones, with "held" poses even longer. But the bulk of most pictures were on twos because most action doesn't require ones.
See this page on Michael Sporn's animation blog about Disney's second feature, 1940's Pinocchio, and the frame rate varying depending on the action for a scene of Stromboli, animated by the incredible Vladimir "Bill" Tytla.
Hope that helps clarify things. _________________ * * *
"The absence of limitations is the enemy of art."
― Orson Welles
Last edited by Maurice on Fri Sep 01, 2023 12:52 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Bud Brewster Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)

Joined: 14 Dec 2013 Posts: 17637 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2023 11:26 pm Post subject: |
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Maurice wrote: | Hope that helps clarify things. |
It does indeed, Maurice!
I didn't realize it was a matter of "some scenes were shot on ones and some scenes were shot on twos" in each given movie!
Thanks to you I now understand that its a shot-by-shot decision. When you said "most Disney movies were shot on twos", you meant that the majority of the frames in all Disney movies were shot on twos, and only selected scenes were shot on ones when that was necessary to maintain the quality of the animation!
Now that I understand that, the policy makes perfect sense!
Silly me! Forgive me for being so slow!  _________________ ____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958) |
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Krel Space Ranger
Joined: 19 Feb 2023 Posts: 190
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Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2023 9:09 pm Post subject: |
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There is a new book on "Forbidden Planet", CANDID MONSTERS VOLUME 21 SF Pt.6.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CGMFBJZG/ref=sr_1_1?crid=DJQY0Q39Y2FV&keywords=candid%20monsters%2021&qid=1693021360&sprefix=candid%20monsters%2021%2Caps%2C89&sr=8-1
From the Amazon site:
"Hi, I’m a film director / writer / producer and publisher. I’ve published SPFX (Special Effects Magazine) since 1976. Over the past 45 years I’ve been collecting candid, behind the scenes photos from science-fiction, horror, fantasy and animation films. I also have access to many interviews and articles with our favorite actors and filmmakers.
In CANDID MONSTERS Volume 21 (Science-Fiction) Part 6 you’ll find: Making FORBIDDEN PLANET…Articles, Interviews, Candid Behind the Scenes Photos, Scrapbook…and more! Also articles and interviews from Robby the Robot’s second feature, THE INVISIBLE BOY. The book is in Full Color with months spent colorizing candid and production photos.
• Contents Include: MAKING FORBIDDEN PLANET. Film history with comments from cast and crew.
• Article by Cinematographer George Folsey.
• Interviews with: LESLIE NIELSEN, ANNE FRANCIS, WARREN STEVENS, RICHARD ANDERSON, GEORGE DEWEY WALLACE, ROBERT DIX, and JAMES DRURY.
• Forbidden Planet SCRAPBOOK. Plenty of Candid Photos, Auction Photos, Production Props and Set Pieces…and more!
• THE INVISIBLE BOY Retrospective. Film history and comments from cast and crew.
• RICHARD EYER Interview.
• The Invisible Boy: LOCATIONS: THEN & NOW.
And, of course over 500 photos including many candid, behind the scenes shots! 140 Pages. Square Bound. Hardcover versions are also available!
$40.23 for the hardcover. $33.69 for the paperback."
I'm not a big fan of colorized photos, but you have to take what you can get.
David. |
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orzel-w Galactic Ambassador

Joined: 19 Sep 2014 Posts: 1865
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Posted: Tue Aug 29, 2023 12:55 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks, David. I ordered the Kindle edition. _________________ ...or not...
WayneO
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Bud Brewster Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)

Joined: 14 Dec 2013 Posts: 17637 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Tue Aug 29, 2023 6:11 pm Post subject: |
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What a magnificent publication this is! I'll definitely buy it.
Frankly, though, I was shocked when I saw the cover art, because it appeared that a portion of my painting (posted here on All Sci-Fi) had been used on the cover.
But a comparisons proved that it isn't my painting . . . unless somebody made significant alterations.
However, I found a website which features some of my own artwork at this link — Uncle Oldies Collectibles, and they include the cover of this book, as if I'd painted it!
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For the record, I did NOT create this magnificent painting — even the face of Morbius, which is similar to my painting above.
But I certainly forgive the site administrators of "Uncle Odie's Collectibles" for assuming that my artwork was used in the cover of this book. _________________ ____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958)
Last edited by Bud Brewster on Fri Sep 01, 2023 8:16 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Gord Green Galactic Ambassador

Joined: 06 Oct 2014 Posts: 3001 Location: Buffalo, NY
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Posted: Thu Aug 31, 2023 6:25 pm Post subject: |
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KREL WROTE:
Quote: | There is a new book on "Forbidden Planet", CANDID MONSTERS VOLUME 21 SF Pt.6. |
I received my copy of the paperback today. All and all I'm glad I did.
Please note that the production article is a revised and expanded version of the CINIMAFANTASIQUE articles but much easier to read. (I still have to go deeper into the book to really see how much has been added.) There is quite a bit about the cut and deleted scenes. The interviews are ones I had not seen before and there are a lot of new photos.
Over all I give the book a solid B. If you're a FP fanatic like me it's a must have addition to your sci-fi library, at least in the kindle edition! _________________ There comes a time, thief, when gold loses its lustre, and the gems cease to sparkle, and the throne room becomes a prison; and all that is left is a father's love for his child. |
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tmlindsey Quantum Engineer

Joined: 18 Jul 2022 Posts: 397 Location: NW Florida
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Posted: Thu Aug 31, 2023 10:32 pm Post subject: |
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Hey Gord,
Is there much in the way of Robby info, specifically previously unseen or rare photos or blueprints? _________________ "Have you never wondered what it would be like to walk between the ticks and tocks of Time?" |
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Gord Green Galactic Ambassador

Joined: 06 Oct 2014 Posts: 3001 Location: Buffalo, NY
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Posted: Thu Aug 31, 2023 10:52 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Tim,
There's a lot of Robby info and pictures (All in color.), No new blueprints to speaK of, but a lot of blueprints anyway, but more pics and info on "The Invisible Boy".
I've seen and downloaded a lot of pictures from the Facebook site and many of them are in the book. The Robby info is at least treated technically (if that makes sense!) and in more depth than in most magazine articles from the past.
Like I said, I like the book, but it may not be worth it to someone who is not a major fan! _________________ There comes a time, thief, when gold loses its lustre, and the gems cease to sparkle, and the throne room becomes a prison; and all that is left is a father's love for his child. |
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Gord Green Galactic Ambassador

Joined: 06 Oct 2014 Posts: 3001 Location: Buffalo, NY
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Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2023 3:38 am Post subject: |
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If you enjoyed the tour of Morbius's study, check out these two videos!
_________ Forbidden Planet RESIDENCE+STUDY
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_________________ Forbidden Planet, Krell Lab
___________ _________________ There comes a time, thief, when gold loses its lustre, and the gems cease to sparkle, and the throne room becomes a prison; and all that is left is a father's love for his child. |
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orzel-w Galactic Ambassador

Joined: 19 Sep 2014 Posts: 1865
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Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2023 12:07 pm Post subject: |
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Gord Green wrote: | If you enjoyed the tour of Morbius's study, check out these two videos! |
ZOUNDS! _________________ ...or not...
WayneO
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Bud Brewster Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)

Joined: 14 Dec 2013 Posts: 17637 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2023 4:23 pm Post subject: |
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Gordo, I'm amazed at all the incredible features that Robert Brydson designed for his expanded version of both the living room and the study!
I'm extremely familiar with the details of this set from Forbidden Planet, because back in 2014 I created a long and detailed posts (with many images) which took the reader on a virtual tour of the house.
Sadly, that post was lost when the old version of All Sci-Fi crashed in 2015. But I managed to recreate it (as best I could) on this current version of the board, a few months after the crash.
Here's the link to my "recreated post", located on page 20 of this thread, about halfway down the page.
The Elegant Decor of the Morbius Home
Knowing the set as well as I do, I quickly noticed a few "alternate versions" of the decor shown in the YouTube video.
In addition to this, Mr. Bryson added some wonderful decor in the new areas he created — the areas which were beyond the limits of the set.
This is also true for a few scenes where the camera didn't include a portion the set, even though it existed.
For example, the upper part of the wall behind Adams in this scene is never shown, anywhere in the movie!
Despite this fact, we can identify the statue behind Adams as the one created by artist Sasha Brastoff, whose work is feature throughout the Morbius home!
The base, the lower legs, and the shadow which shows the bend in the leg all match the one shown in the publicity photo shown a bit further down.
And Mr. Robert Bryson also created a wall decoration for the unseen area above the table, as well as a third table decoration on the far left, which we also never glimpse in the film.
Mr. Bryson's video includes the Sasha Brastoff statue that actually was on the set, even though we only see the pedestal and the lower legs in one scene . . . throughout the entire movie!
Unfortunately Mr. Bryson's rendering of the statue has several inaccuracies. It doesn't show the raised foot or the bent knee. Also, the raised hand should be directly above the figure's "face", not angled slightly away from the head.
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However, the amazing thing about the video is the way Mr. Bryson created the portions of the living room which did not exist in the set — because they fill in the area where the film crew was located!
The screen shot below is a view which looks back into the living room, as if this area of the room had existed, instead of being the "fourth wall" on the set.
Notice the chairs at the dinning room table on the left, and the sofa to the right where Adams sat when we get the partial view of the Sasha Brastoff statue against the wall on the far right.
And bless my soul, I was amazed when I realized that the back wall has a section made of natural rocks, below which is a fireplace! It has a black mantle above the "firebox", and above that is a piece of abstract art!
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To the left of the fireplace is a set of shelves with coffee cups and containers for ground coffee, sugar, and creamer.
On the wall to the left is another wall decoration — a piece somewhat similar to the one which Mr. Bryson placed on the wall behind Adams when he was sitting on the couch in the screen shot I posted above.
To the left of the coffee cup shelves is a set of double doors, located just beyond the dining room table.
I think it's logical to assume that these doors lead to the kitchen!
Their proximity to the dinning room table and the shelves with the coffee items supports this idea. And, of course, the coffee table is located close to the shelves which hold the coffee cups, etc.
Gentlemen, absolutely everything which Robert Brydson designed for his expanded version of the Morbius house fits perfectly with the actual set — both aesthetically and functionally.
His work is brilliant!  _________________ ____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958) |
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Gord Green Galactic Ambassador

Joined: 06 Oct 2014 Posts: 3001 Location: Buffalo, NY
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Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2023 7:58 pm Post subject: |
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Bobs' work is indeed amazing!
He's working on a project to do the entire house and more!
I have scores of images he's done, and I'll post more as time goes on.
Here's a bunch more!
Bud, notice the correction in the stance of the Brassoff figure. Bob is continually tweaking the data to perfection.
There's a lot more, and I'll post updates. I just love his dedication to the memory of FP!
_________________ There comes a time, thief, when gold loses its lustre, and the gems cease to sparkle, and the throne room becomes a prison; and all that is left is a father's love for his child. |
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tmlindsey Quantum Engineer

Joined: 18 Jul 2022 Posts: 397 Location: NW Florida
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Posted: Tue Sep 05, 2023 8:49 am Post subject: |
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Gord Green wrote: | Hi Tim,
There's a lot of Robby info and pictures (All in color.), No new blueprints to speaK of, but a lot of blueprints anyway, but more pics and info on "The Invisible Boy".
I've seen and downloaded a lot of pictures from the Facebook site and many of them are in the book. |
Thanks, Gord! I love FP but my main focus is everything Robby
Do you have that Facebook link with the pictures? I couldn't find it. _________________ "Have you never wondered what it would be like to walk between the ticks and tocks of Time?" |
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Gord Green Galactic Ambassador

Joined: 06 Oct 2014 Posts: 3001 Location: Buffalo, NY
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Posted: Tue Sep 05, 2023 5:45 pm Post subject: |
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Tim.
Here you go! Check out the media and files too.Lots of goodies!
https://www.facebook.com/groups/forbiddenplanetmovie _________________ There comes a time, thief, when gold loses its lustre, and the gems cease to sparkle, and the throne room becomes a prison; and all that is left is a father's love for his child. |
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