ALL SCI-FI Forum Index ALL SCI-FI
The place to “find your people”.
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Forbidden Planet (1956)
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 130, 131, 132 ... 141, 142, 143  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    ALL SCI-FI Forum Index -> Sci-Fi Movies and Serials from 1950 to 1969
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Bud Brewster
Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)


Joined: 14 Dec 2013
Posts: 17020
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2021 9:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

________________________________

Thanks for the info about the artist. Everything you said about the burial of Morbius, etc. sounds very reasonable. Good job. Cool

Personnelly I prefer cremation over burial, and that's what I've requested in my will. Both my father and mother were cremated as well.

Since the graveyard (along with the entire planet) is going to be "cremated" just a few hours after the burial, I just don't think Adams and Altaira would take the time.

And don't forget that Doc would have to be buried, too! John and Altaira couldn't take his body back to the ship in tractor because it wouldn't hold Robby, Doc's body, and the two of them.

Hell's bells, Robby wouldn't even fit through that little door!






Plus the tractor would be too slow, and if they're going to hang around the house long enough for the two burials, they'll certainly need to get back to the ship as quickly as possible.

This is a fun debate! I hope a few of the other members will ring in with their thoughts on the subject. Very Happy

_________________
____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Krel
Guest





PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2021 3:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bud, Robby's seat is hanging off the back of the tractor.

I have this image in my mind of the tractor frantically racing across the desert with Robby bobbing, swinging and swaying wildly as he dangles from the electromagnet. Laughing Hopefully they tied Robby off so that wouldn't happen.

Of course, if they could reactivate Robby, then they could have used his car, which would be the fastest way to get back to C-57-D.

David.
Back to top
Bud Brewster
Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)


Joined: 14 Dec 2013
Posts: 17020
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Tue Aug 17, 2021 9:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

________________________________

David, I salute your original thinking! And the mental image is hysterical! Laughing

Unfortunately, if they CAN'T reactivate Robby they'd never get him out to the tractor. He weights enough to balance ten tons of shielding on one hand! Shocked






But fortunately they DID reactivate him, as we know from the scene below.



_________________
____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Gord Green
Galactic Ambassador


Joined: 06 Oct 2014
Posts: 2940
Location: Buffalo, NY

PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2021 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bud,

To answer a private conversation....

From page 100 of the script ;



Yes, I checked this with the ACTUAL dialogue in the movie....And it is there!

Instead of sending it to me you can use the $20 to buy yourself a nice dinner.

May I suggest 3 and 20 blackbirds baked into a pie?
LOL! Just kidding....Have a nice steak!

_________________
There comes a time, thief, when gold loses its lustre, and the gems cease to sparkle, and the throne room becomes a prison; and all that is left is a father's love for his child.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Bud Brewster
Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)


Joined: 14 Dec 2013
Posts: 17020
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2021 7:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

________________________________

Oops, I'm puzzled. Confused

We must have misunderstood each other on the matter of who decided to put Doc in the tractor. I thought you said Adams told Robby to do it.

I said he didn't. Robby just volunteered to do it, then we see Robby walking out while carrying a very unconvincing mannequin. Laughing

Gord, the reason I was so certain of this when we talked on the phone is because I've had the dialog in that movie memorized since I was a teenager, listening to a reel-to-reel recording I made from a TV airing when it came on in 1965. In fact, I can state (without even checking my DVD) that Robby actually says the following, without any command from Adams.

"I will PLACE him in the tractor, sir." (Rather than LAY him, as the script above states.)

And Adams just replies, "Thank you," (without saying Robby's name, as the script indicates).

In addition to hearing the audio recording of the movie many times, long before getting my first VHS tape or DVD of the movie, I actually shot a roll pictures right off the screen of our old black & white TV with my trusty little Brownie Starmite III —




— including the one below. Pretty bad, eh? Rolling Eyes





In 1963 I even tried to shoot a roll in a theater during one of the many times I went to see Jason and the Argonauts. Those pictures didn't come out at all. Not enough light . . . Sad
_________________
____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Krel
Guest





PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2021 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As they buried their dead crew mates on the planet, I seriously doubt that Doc's body made the return trip.

David.
Back to top
Bud Brewster
Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)


Joined: 14 Dec 2013
Posts: 17020
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2021 8:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

________________________________

That's an excellent point, David. Very Happy

The difference between the dead crewmen and the situation with Doc and Morbius is that in just 24 hours all the bodies, all the new graves, and the entire graveyard will be vaporized when this happens.






And so, with all due respect to Gord's differing opinion on the subject, I just don't think intelligent people who knew they needed to leave Altair 4 as quickly as possible would waste a single second digging graves . . . when the entire planet was about to be "cremated"! Very Happy
_________________
____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
trekriffic
Starship Navigator


Joined: 19 Feb 2015
Posts: 593

PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2021 9:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Excellent analysis Bud. Why bury a body in a graveyard that itself was about to be cremated? Makes no sense really.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Bud Brewster
Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)


Joined: 14 Dec 2013
Posts: 17020
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2021 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

________________________________

Thanks.

My feeling is that safeguarding the lives of human beings is far more important than a ceremony whose only practical purpose is the disposal of human remains — especially in this extreme situation. Sad

_________________
____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Krel
Guest





PostPosted: Fri Sep 10, 2021 11:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please forgive me if this has been posted before, but this site has the FP novel that can be downloaded.

https://libgen.is/search.php?req=forbidden%20planet&lg_topic=libgen&open=0&view=simple&res=25&phrase=1&column=def&fbclid=IwAR0dMIfZn81XP8GaMUUk-gva6g9des7XY6GbXiKEvnzxJ41_epNks7Dgp8M

David.
Back to top
Bud Brewster
Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)


Joined: 14 Dec 2013
Posts: 17020
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Sat Sep 11, 2021 2:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

________________________________

It took me a while to find it, but Butch posted the link below to another version of the book, about one third of the way down on page 88 of this thread!

https://epdf.pub/forbidden-planet.html

But that's okay, David, because the versions are difference, and now we have both yours and his so it won't be as hard to find one the next time somebody wonders if we've got it! Very Happy

_________________
____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Morbius
Astral Engineer


Joined: 25 Oct 2014
Posts: 207

PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2021 3:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My 3D Robby

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Bud Brewster
Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)


Joined: 14 Dec 2013
Posts: 17020
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2021 2:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

________________________________

Wow! The most delicious-looking lemon drop in history! Cool

You told me you had several of these magnificent 3D printed Robbys. If you're planning to show us pictures of the stages required to complete each one, we're eager to see them! Very Happy



______________
_________________
____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Morbius
Astral Engineer


Joined: 25 Oct 2014
Posts: 207

PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2021 2:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a Robby head, cast in metal, will post if I can find.

Two other examples.



The idea was to make a solid metal figure, but never got to it.


Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Gord Green
Galactic Ambassador


Joined: 06 Oct 2014
Posts: 2940
Location: Buffalo, NY

PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2021 12:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I found this retrospective and thought I'd share it here :

"I saw that TCM is going to show one of the great and iconic Science Fiction films of all time. As I have never written my comments on this film, it is about time.

Turner Classic Movies has shown the visionary ‘Forbidden Planet’ (1956), one of the most imaginative and influential Science Fiction films ever made, but I had never actually made it my pick of the month. I guess that was on the theory that everyone already knew about it. It has been inaccurately claimed to be the first Science Fiction film to ever take place entirely in space.

No scenes of this film take place on Earth or even in our solar system, though the characters are all humans or one of a couple of zoo animals. Well…that is if we disqualify a robot from being a character. Sadly, it does not even hold the distinction of being the first truly space-bound film. That distinction probably goes to ‘Cat Women Of The Moon’ (1953).

‘Forbidden Planet’ is probably the best Science Fiction film of the 1950s. It is the closest to the quality of contemporaneous written Science Fiction, a genuine scientific puzzle with a sophisticated problem solution. Along the way, we really are given all the clues necessary to solve the murder. Visually, the film probably shows the greatest imagination of any 50s film in any genre and, when seen in its widescreen format, much of it still looks very good 65 years later. The beautiful planet-scapes and space-scapes would not be surpassed until ‘Star Wars’. For the pre-digital age, the effects are very impressive and the scenes are all the more impressive in widescreen format.

This is in spite of the fact that what was released was only a rough-cut of the film with what we shall see are plenty of errors. Not that it is so much a tribute to this film, but when Gene Roddenberry was planning the original ‘Star Trek’ series, he pitched it as being ‘’Wagon Train To The Stars’, but what he was really planning was ‘Forbidden Planet: The TV Series’. The film is almost a template for the original ‘Star Trek.’ Bits of the ideas show up throughout Science Fiction to come like bits of the props showed up in ‘Twilight Zone’ episodes.

The characters are a little stereotypical and 1950s-ish in their sensibilities and their morality. Much has been made of the idea that the story was built around the plot of Shakespeare’s ‘Tempest’. That may be true, but little more than the basic situation and some of the characters are taken from Shakespeare. The murder mystery, which is the main thrust of the plot and the character’s motivations are entirely different from the Shakespeare. For those who have not seen it, the story, in short, deals with a rescue mission to the planet Altair IV.

An expedition to the planet two decades before had disappeared without a sign. From Earth, United Planets Cruiser C-57D captained by Commander Adams (played by Leslie Nielsen) comes to investigate and discovers the sole survivor living on the planet with his daughter. Nearly everyone else from the expedition had been killed under very mysterious circumstances, ripped apart by an unseen force. Only Dr. Morbius (Walter Pidgeon) and his wife survived and died of what we are told were natural causes a year or so later.

In the light of the denouement, one wonders if that is actually true. Morbius’s only company is his daughter Altaira (Anne Francis) who was born on this planet and Robbie, a fascinating robot who talks but prefixes every speech with the sound of an old-fashioned mechanical adding machine.

Connected with the mystery of what happened to the original expedition is the fact that the planet was at one time millions of years earlier inhabited by a super-scientific civilisation that were called the Krell. One of the points of the story was to show the immense power that the Krell had and, for once, what we see really seems to confirm the fact. The great set-piece of the film is a visit to one of four hundred Krell power shafts. We see four or five levels of what we are told are 7800 levels. So what we are seeing is a tiny fraction of what the film claims the Krell had, but what we do see is dumbfoundingly immense. This is a film that really dwarfs the human and overwhelms the viewer with the magnitude of what is possible.

This is a film with beautiful effects that rely in large part on matte paintings and not models. That approach gave the effects department much more artistic freedom in the images it could create. Mostly the effect was used for planet-scapes and space-scapes, but they are impressive. Then there is Robby, the most famous film robot outside of the ‘Star Wars’ universe. Over the years, the suit became almost a star in itself. The design is incredibly creative, with a flurry of moving parts and flashing neon to make it look more like a mechanical device than a man in a robot suit. Each time the robot speaks, it is prefaced by the noise of a cash register as if it is computing mechanically. The voice is Marvin Miller, a familiar voice often used for narration and dubbing at the time. Those who remember 1950s television may remember him as Michael Anthony in the television series ‘The Millionaire.

Special mention should be made of the electronic music by Louis and Beebe Barron. It was the first totally electronic score in a feature film and the MGM music department would not even allow it to be called a score. They were somewhat disappointed that there was not more interest in their new musical form, ‘electronic tonalities’. In 1976, Louis Barron decided that there might be a market for the soundtrack on record. He still had LPs, so packed some cases at his own expense. He brought a case to MidAmeriCon, the World Science Fiction Convention, in the hopes that there might be some interest in the record. He told himself that some people might still be interested in the unusual score after 21 years.

After selling in the huckster room for an hour he put in an emergency call home to Beebe saying to ship him the all rest of the cases as quickly as possible. He had no idea the demand that there would be either for the record or for himself. He suddenly found himself to be a celebrity. For years, I remember seeing copies of the record for sale. I believe it is even on CD. I hope the latter-day popularity of the score helped the Barrons in their later years.

Leslie Nielsen plays his role straight, as he would his roles for many years to come. But it is hard to see him in this film without being reminded of his later slapstick comedy roles. Walter Pidgeon is clearly a bit uncomfortable in a role very unlike what he is used to playing. Of course, that quality may be just what Morbius needs. Anne Francis in an ingenue role is somewhat better than many young starlets who have been in similar roles. Les Tremayne who played a general in ‘War Of The Worlds’ narrates three or four sentences at the beginning.

But even so great a film as ‘Forbidden Planet’ has a few flaws and I will talk about them this week. Apparently, MGM wanted to get the film out with as little expense as possible. It already has cost $1.9 million, then the most ever spent to make a Science Fiction film and they did not want to sink much more in. The executives decided on releasing the rough-cut of the film that it did not want to pay for a final editing. As a result, we see many editing problems that really should have been corrected. There are little pieces of conversations that seem either incomplete or totally incoherent. When the cruiser comes out of hyperspace, Cmdr. Adams (Leslie Nielsen) is momentarily angry at Jerry, perhaps for navigating the cruiser so close to a star. But Adams never finishes his sentence and the matter is totally dropped, so we have no confirmation of what it was all about.

In another scene, we can suppose that Dr. Ostrow (Warren Stevens) has started to say something to Adams and stopped himself. But it would seem the scene was cut. All we have left is him telling Adams, ‘nothing important, skipper’. In another scene, Altaira has decided she loves Adams, but there is nothing that makes it obvious when seeing her. Still, Adams tells Ostrow, ‘Something new has been added.’ Ostrow looks at Altaira and somehow knows what Adams means. He comments, ‘That will complicate things.’ He can see love in Altaira somehow, but what he is seeing is invisible to the viewer. It can also be seen by the tiger apparently and he turns on her, though why a tiger should behave differently to her because she was in love is never explained. Adams seems surprised that Alta does not understand, but I have to admit I don’t either.

Much of the dialogue is scientifically absurd, like the implication that lead isotope 217 is lighter than ordinary lead. Some of the science jargon is complete nonsense, with phrases like ‘short-circuit the continuum on a 5 or 6-parsec level’. I might be overruled on this but that sounds like a load of jargon duck tires.

There are signs that even director Fred M. Wilcox did not give the script a close reading. We are told that the energy shaft is twenty miles square. Morbius tells this to Adams pointing horizontally saying, ‘Twenty miles’, and then pointing in the opposite direction repeating, ‘Twenty miles.’ That would make the shaft forty miles across and the characters would already be in the centre. In fact, they probably were in a corner of the shaft and he was supposed to be pointing along two perpendicular edges.

In another scene, Altaira describes a dress in detail for Robby to make. When we see the dress the length is about right, but otherwise, it looks very different from what was described.

More possible errors: the credits call Anne Francis ‘Altaira’, but in the film she is almost always called ‘Alta.’ She is introduced with the shorter name, but characters seem to know about the longer one. When the monster is tracked on radar it is as big as a house, when we see it is roughly the size of an elephant.

There are some other visual problems. Even the outdoor sets were clearly shot on soundstages, giving the film a claustrophobic set-bound feel. The outdoor paintings are all too obviously paintings, albeit imaginative, with an inexhaustible supply of nearby moons. The feel is again reminiscent of the early days of ‘Star Trek’. Some of the props are a little strange. The klystron monitor looks like a distiller; blasters look a little too much like dressed-up packing tubes. When we first see Altaira with a tiger, the cat walks in front of a red bush and Altaira follows it. Someone must have sprayed the bush between when the cat was filmed and when Francis was. The bush turns redder in pieces as Francis walks by it. We see the camera move just a little each time a panel is shut around Morbius’ home.

MGM was not able to do themselves all the effects for ‘Forbidden Planet’ and got some technical aid from Disney Studios. The result is that several of the scenes have the unmistakable feel of Disney animation. When we see sparks in Robby’s dome or long arcs of electricity, they look like Disney animation. When walking to the reactor, we see a scene in the power shaft that looks very much like Disney animation. I assume they also did the rays coming out of the blasters, but not very well. The line of the blast remains steady even though the gun is shaking around.

But even with all the ground-breaking approaches in this film, the filmmakers were afraid to make a future without paying their tribute to religion. A special effort is made to show that these future people still believe in God. As Ostrow says, ‘The Lord sure made some beautiful worlds.’
This is one of the great Science Fiction films of all time. I give it a full +4 on the -4 to +4 scale.

Mark R. Leeper October 2021

_________________
There comes a time, thief, when gold loses its lustre, and the gems cease to sparkle, and the throne room becomes a prison; and all that is left is a father's love for his child.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    ALL SCI-FI Forum Index -> Sci-Fi Movies and Serials from 1950 to 1969 All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 130, 131, 132 ... 141, 142, 143  Next
Page 131 of 143

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group