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johnnybear Mission Specialist
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Joined: 15 Jun 2016 Posts: 441
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Posted: Sat Jun 26, 2021 6:59 am Post subject: |
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What about the Romulan vessels that attacked the Enterprise when it deliberately traveled across the Neutral zone and into their space to reach a Starbase on the orders of Commodore Stocker in The Deadly Years?
JB |
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Bud Brewster Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)
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Joined: 14 Dec 2013 Posts: 17174 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Sat Jun 26, 2021 9:03 am Post subject: |
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That was indeed a season 2 episode, JB.
On the other hand, the number of Romulan ships which surrounded the Enterprise is said to ten, according to Sulu. So, we're stuck with having to explain why so many Birds of Prey were in that area.
Suggestions, anyone!
By the way, the enhanced FX for that scene are wonderful! And I was amused by the way the bridge crew all "leaned back" when the ship went straight warp 8 to escape the Romulans.
Perhaps the seats should be equipped with both seat beats AND head rests to prevent whip lash! Or maybe it would be called . . . warp lash.
____The Deadly Years remastered - Kirk to the rescue!
__________ ![](https://i3.ytimg.com/vi/qnr1dOYvs3w/hqdefault.jpg) _________________ ____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958) |
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Pow Galactic Ambassador
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Joined: 27 Sep 2014 Posts: 3446 Location: New York
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Posted: Sun May 15, 2022 5:10 pm Post subject: |
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A review from the Sci Fi Freak Site.
This episode is very effective and tense. We see two captains of equal standing take each other on with ships of equal but different advantages.
Neither come off unscathed.
There is a bit more depth here as well as both captains grapple with their actions which might launch a war killing millions on both sides.
The fact that the Romulans are revealed to look like Vulcans adds to the tensions, but the angle is overplayed and creates more melodrama than is good for the show.
Mark Lenard makes a good showing as the Romulan equivalent of Captain Kirk.
Sidebar: One of the best episodes from season one of the series. Although the Romulans are clearly the aggressors here, you feel the humanity and sadness and conflicts within the Romulan commander, so well played by the terrific Mark Lenard.
I'm unsure just what the reviewer means when he says that "the angle is overplayed" regarding the stunning discovery that the Romulans are genetically related to the Vulcans?
Did the reviewer feel that the whole racist reaction by navigator Stiles towards Mr. Spock was melodramatic?
I felt that it addressed an interesting topic for the episode and showed that even by Star Trek's era, humans can still possess unreasoning hatred for those different from them.
Why wouldn't we humans do this with aliens? We have humans hating humans right here on earth, so aliens sure aren't gonna get a pass from some human beings.
I'm surprised that this aspect of the script got past Roddenberry who desired to show his vision of the future having perfect humans in the Federation of Planets and Starfleet without any conflicts whatsoever between themselves.
I thought that one of the coolest dramatic moments was when Kirk put Stiles in his place regarding his snide comments about Spock.
I did question that a junior officer like Stiles would be that
blatantly disparaging to the second-in-command of the Enterprise. Military hierarchies usually don't allow that kind of stuff.
However, in the interest of drama we have to have a willing suspension of disbelief here and there. |
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scotpens Starship Captain
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Joined: 19 Sep 2014 Posts: 883 Location: The Left Coast
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Posted: Mon May 16, 2022 12:48 am Post subject: |
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Pow wrote: | . . . I'm surprised that this aspect of the script got past Roddenberry who desired to show his vision of the future having perfect humans in the Federation of Planets and Starfleet without any conflicts whatsoever between themselves. |
That nonsense only started with Star Trek: The Next Generation. In the original series, Roddenberry saw humanity as perhaps a bit more enlightened than present-day (i.e. mid-20th-century) man, but hardly perfect or without conflict.
But by the time of TNG, Gene had begun to let the adulation of millions of fans go to his head, and I think he actually saw himself as a great visionary and prophet of future humanity. In other words, he had started believing his own bullshit. |
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Bud Brewster Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)
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Joined: 14 Dec 2013 Posts: 17174 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Mon May 16, 2022 9:45 am Post subject: |
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I think you're right, Scot.
In the TNG season 1 episode where the Enterprise discoveres an old spacecraft with frozen folks in it, Picard told one of the defrosted people that there was no more television because people spent their time "bettering themselves". And he told the wealthy man that "the acquisition of money" was no long important to people.
Sounds like a description of the monks in a monastery. ![Rolling Eyes](images/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif) _________________ ____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958) |
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Pow Galactic Ambassador
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Joined: 27 Sep 2014 Posts: 3446 Location: New York
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Posted: Mon May 30, 2022 11:25 pm Post subject: |
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I just watched this episode last Saturday night on MeTV when I was struck by something Captain Kirk said.
Mr. Spock informs Kirk that the cloaked Romulan vessel is making a "leisurely maneuver towards home," and that the Romulans may not be aware of the Enterprise following them.
Kirk says that perhaps their cloaking device works both ways, meaning it makes the Romulan ship invisible to other vessels, but then the Romulan ship's sensors are unable to detect anything when they're cloaked.
If Kirk is correct, then this cloak would create a terrible vulnerability to any spaceship utilizing it.
Wouldn't it indicate that such a ship would be unable to operate their scanning and sensor systems whenever they were invisible?
In which case, how do they navigate, detect planets, other ships, spatial phenomena, or even set a course? In one scene we see the Romulan Commander and his crew watching a comet in space on their individual viewers. "Behold a marvel in the darkness" observes the captain.
The Romulan craft was cloaked at the time, so how were they also able to have their scanners visually give them real time pictures of the comet?
Was Kirk incorrect? Can the Romulans use both their cloaking device and their scanning system simultaneously?
Then why did they casually head for home if they knew the Enterprise was pursuing them? Wouldn't they have turned to face the Enterprise in battle if their sensors told them the Federation starship was behind them?
In several scenes the Romulans mention the position of the Enterprise while they are cloaked?
So just how does this cloaking system work exactly? Only at the whims of the scriptwriter depending on what he needs to do to move the story along? |
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Pow Galactic Ambassador
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Joined: 27 Sep 2014 Posts: 3446 Location: New York
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Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2022 5:40 pm Post subject: |
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Some differences between the broadcast episode of "Balance of Terror," and the adaptation by James Blish in his novel. Part One.
On the episode, Captain Kirk starts to address everyone in the Enterprise's chapel for the wedding ceremony when the ship's alarm goes off.
In the novel, the bride, Angela Martine, is being escorted down the aisle by Scotty, when the alarm sounds. So Kirk never even got to speak at all.
Episode: Mr. Spock, from his science station, puts the view on the bridge's main viewscreen of the Romulan vessel attacking the Federation outpost S-4023.
Novel: It is Uhura who does this from her communications station.
Episode: The Enterprise sees only the Romulan ship on their viewscreen in this initial encounter.
Novel: The Enterprise crew can see the underside of the Romulan ship with its Bird of Prey painting in clear view.
Episode: The Romulans hail from the twin planets Romulas and Remus, and that is all that the Federation of Planets knows about them.
Novel: Experts postulated that the Romulans were not native to those planets.
Episode: No one from the Federation of Planets had ever seen a Romulan in person.
Novel: A few bloated Romulan bodies had been recovered during the original Federation-Romulan War of a century ago. They were described as being "hawklike Vulcanite types rather than Earthly anthropoid,"
Episode: Origin of the Romulan race is unknown to the Federation of Planets.
Novel: Experts had guessed that the Romulans might have settled on their adopted planet as a splinter group from some mass migration, thrown off, rejected by their less militaristic fellows.
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Sidebar: I'm glad that the episode kept the Romulans identity a mystery at the start compared to the information
revealed in the novel. It created much more suspense, and made the scene where the Enterprise crew first see exactly what the Romulans look like much more surprising and dramatic. Especially for Mr. Spock.
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Episode: We see a map of the Romulan's home worlds.
Novel: It establishes that Romulas & Remus both orbit a white-dwarf sun.
Episode: Mr. Spock relays information regarding the status of the Federation outposts from communications to sensor readings.
Novel: Uhura does this.
Episode: On the Enterprise's main viewer, the crew sees the attack by the Romulans upon the outpost via the outpost's cameras. During the attack they can see the Romulan ship's cloaking ability.
Novel: The Enterprise sees the attack by the Romulans, but not its cloaking capability. After the outpost is blasted by the Romulan weapon, all visual contact is lost from their camera transmission to the Enterprise, so the Enterprise never does see the alien ship cloak. |
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Gord Green Galactic Ambassador
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Joined: 06 Oct 2014 Posts: 2948 Location: Buffalo, NY
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Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2022 3:59 am Post subject: |
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Hummm...Maybe better to be a Brown coat than a red shirt.
Any other Firefly fans out there? _________________ There comes a time, thief, when gold loses its lustre, and the gems cease to sparkle, and the throne room becomes a prison; and all that is left is a father's love for his child. |
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Bud Brewster Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)
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Joined: 14 Dec 2013 Posts: 17174 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2022 12:08 pm Post subject: |
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Hey, who ISN'T a Firefly fan? Communists and Neanderthals, maybe. ![Rolling Eyes](images/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif) _________________ ____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958) |
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Pow Galactic Ambassador
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Joined: 27 Sep 2014 Posts: 3446 Location: New York
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Posted: Fri Jun 03, 2022 3:11 pm Post subject: |
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Shiny! |
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Pow Galactic Ambassador
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Joined: 27 Sep 2014 Posts: 3446 Location: New York
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Posted: Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:42 pm Post subject: |
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Part Two, Differences from the aired episode of "Balance of Terror," and the James Blish adaptation for the book.
Episode: The Federation of Planets have established a series of outposts along their border and the Romulan border known as the Neutral Zone. These outposts are constructed inside asteroids with a crew of 20.
Book: Jim Blish only refers to them as outpost satellites. Never does he write that they are located within an asteroid.
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Sidebar: There really isn't any reason that these outposts couldn't have been artificial space stations instead of being inside an asteroid. The exterior of the asteroid is never seen on the main viewer of the Enterprise at all.
I imagine that this was done as a cost saving measure on the weekly budget. So if the asteroid isn't seen on the episode, they would not have had to construct an artificial space station practical model which would require money.
They could have just shown Commander Hanson inside outpost 4023 communicating with the Enterprise, which is exactly what they did with this episode No special model work needed for either an asteroid or a space station.
I always try to get a look at Hanson's Starfleet badge that he wears on his uniform, but I never can make it out clearly.
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Novel: "Neither Scott nor McCoy liked the Vulcanite. Kirk, much though he valued his First Officer, was not entirely comfortable in his presence."
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Sidebar: Wow! On the show those are not the feelings of Kirk, McCoy, or Scotty towards Spock at all. Spock is never referred to as a Vulcanite on any episode of the series during its three year run.
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Book: Lieutenant Uhuru is able to pick up the Romulan ship's De Broglie waves when they are invisible.
Episode: No such thing as De Broglie waves are ever mentioned.
Book: Scott said, "It's a fair balance of power, I'd say, Jim."
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Sidebar: I don't believe that Scotty utters this sentence in the episode. However, it's the closest we get to having dialogue match the episode title. Also, Scotty almost never calls Kirk by his first name like Dr. McCoy often does.
Book: When Uhura is able to get a picture of the Romulan bridge on the Enterprise's view screen, it describes the Romulan Commander as working in a cockpit-like well and in a white uniform. His crew wore military tunics which bore wolf's-head emblems.
Episode: None of that was in the episode.
Book: Kirk went to school with Commander Hanson.
Episode: This is not mentioned.
Book: Angela Martine and Robert Tomlinson are married by Kirk, when the wedding ceremony resumes.
Episode: This never happens on the episode.
Episode: The Romulan vessel enters a comet in order to obscure the Enterprise's sensors. The Enterprise follows knowing that even though the Romulan ship is invisible, it'll leave a visible trail for the Enterprise to detect.
Book: The comet crosses between the Enterprise and the Romulan ship, but neither spaceship enters the comet at all.
Episode: The Romulan Commander has his ship's debris, caused by a hit by the Enterprise, and the body of his friend, placed into evacuation tubes and sent into space in order to make Kirk think his ship is destroyed. He also places a nuclear warhead that is used for self-destruction, placed in amidst the flotsam, in order to obliterate the Enterprise.
Book: No nuclear warhead is put in amidst the debris.
Episode: Tomlinson dies.
Book: Both Tomlinson & Stiles dies.
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Sidebar: Anyhow, it amazed me at just how many differences there were between the episode and the Jim Blish book.
I'm unsure if Blish was working off an early draft of the script for his book, or if he chose to make these noticeable alterations. If he did that, I would think he would have gotten resistance from Gene Roddenberry over any changes regarding the story.
In the Blish book, we never have any scenes showing dialogue amongst the Romulans at all, as we do in the episode. |
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Bud Brewster Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)
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Posted: Sat Jun 04, 2022 2:46 pm Post subject: |
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To quote a certain Vulcanite, "Fascinating, Mr Powers."
I love the way you compared the episode and the James Blish adaptation.
The one thing about the episode that's a bit tough to explain (even though it's a wonderful scene in the story) is the convenient way the Romulan bridge is briefly viewed by the Enterprise crew — complete with a dramatic "truck in close-up" on the Romulan commander to show that (gasp!) he looks remarkably like Our Favorite Vulcan!
But it's a great moment, and I certainly wouldn't change it.
______________ Balance of Terror (part 2 of 7)
__________ ![](https://i3.ytimg.com/vi/6JIPI7zxpQc/hqdefault.jpg) _________________ ____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958) |
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Pow Galactic Ambassador
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Joined: 27 Sep 2014 Posts: 3446 Location: New York
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2022 9:47 am Post subject: |
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TV Guide Close Up: Responsibility weighs heavily on Captain Kirk, who must make a decision that could trigger a full-scale galactic war.
After a century of peace, the warlike Romulans have sent a powerful flagship to probe earth's defenses. With three outposts already destroyed, Kirk knows that retreat will only invite further devastation. His alternative: counterattack.
Producer Gene Roddenberry created an abundance of special effects to heighten the visual impact of this episode. |
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Pow Galactic Ambassador
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Joined: 27 Sep 2014 Posts: 3446 Location: New York
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Posted: Mon Mar 18, 2024 1:42 pm Post subject: |
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I much preferred the Romulan starship design seen on Star Trek: Enterprise than on this episode, as wonderful as this episode is.
Last edited by Pow on Thu Mar 21, 2024 9:07 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Bud Brewster Galactic Fleet Admiral (site admin)
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Posted: Mon Mar 18, 2024 4:30 pm Post subject: |
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It would be unfair of me to compare this exceptional episode to the Jame Blish version, but I will say that all the changes which were made for the actual episode seem to be good decisions on the part of the producers.
I suspect that these changes made the story easier to follow and enjoy — which is crucial for any TV series which is being watched by both sci-fi fans and "normal" people.
However, one thing struck me as odd about the facts you shared, Pow, concerning Blish's novelization.
We all know that the structure of the TOS story was heavily influence by (and possibly inspired by) the 1957 movie The Enemy Below, in which the captains of both an American destroyer and a German U-Boat matched wits with each other.
That said, I suspect that the difference in Bliss' novelization and the TOS version were caused by the TOS screenwriters who deliberately wanted to make the episode more like the 20th Century Fox movie which aired on NBC's Saturday Night at the Movies, February 4th, 1963, and reran of May 27th, 1963.
The Balance of Terror aired on December 15th, 1966, and when I first watched it I was immediately aware that it was a science fiction version of that wonderful WWII era movie!
Mike, forgive me for having to ask this, but which came first: the finished screenplay or the Bliss novelization? _________________ ____________
Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958) |
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