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Sliders (1995 - 2000)
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Gord Green
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2021 6:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think you're absolutely on point here, Bud.

Assuming an infinite (or so) number of counter Earths there are an infinite number of possibilities. Each "dimension", facet, or whatever you want to call them would be close to unique in every way. Some may be identical, some close to it, some slightly different and some totally different.

Some may have the same physical laws, and some may be completely different.

No doubt some may have never developed life, while others evolved intelligent tigers! Some may be thousands of years behind us, others thousands of years ahead.

To imagine a dimension where what we perceive as magic is the science of that world is not so great a stretch, and yes . . . it is science-fiction!

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Pow
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 1:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The "Dragonslide" world is very similar to Earth Prime from where our Sliders came from in many, many ways.

Since the planet shares a vast number of similarities, it should be relatable to some degree by our Sliders regarding how their magic originates.

Sorry, I guess we'll just have to disagree, since my willing suspension of disbelief ain't willing with this episode.
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Bud Brewster
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

________________________________

I think the limited resources of this series precluded their ability to present a parallel universe in which our form of science did not exist — and the Harry Porter form of magic was common!

But aside from that, I think Gord and I agree that in an infinite number of universes, all variations between the "pure science" worlds and the "pure magic" worlds would exist!

Mike, we can't actually set limits on the variations in an infinite number of universes! Shocked

What this episode tried to do was present an interesting and understandable "mixture" of the two concepts for the benefit of the average TV viewing public.

Forgive me, but the limits of your "suspension of disbelief" seem to be similar to those of the network execs who reluctantly approved this episode and the non-sci-fi viewers who barely understood stories like this. Sad

Mike, I'm sure you appreciate the comprises the producers of this show had to make just to get it on the air! And if it seems too far-defected to you, it must have seemed even more so to the studio execs and the viewing audience. Confused

However . . . we here at All Sci-Fi know that this episode's concept was actually watered-down for the average person in the viewing audience.

With that in mind, I hope you'll re-watch this episode and reconsider your opinion. I think it's a fine example of this series' attempt to present the incredible complexity of a multiverse with an infinite number of worlds! Very Happy

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Last edited by Bud Brewster on Sat May 28, 2022 8:40 am; edited 1 time in total
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Bud Brewster
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 24, 2021 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

________________________________

Today I discovered that the late Andrew Bogdan — aka Bogmeister, my former co-site administrator on All Sci-Fi for six wonderful years — didn't write more reviews for season three of Sliders after the one shown above for Dragonslide! Sad

Worse yet, I also discovered that he only wrote one elaborate post (with many jpegs), which summarized season 4, and another post which summarized season 5. I'll post those two fine reviews by Andrew after I finish watching those season on my box set.

But for now I need to lavish considerable praise on the episode which follows Dragonslide, the one called The Fire Within.

Folks, that fine episode is (in my opinion) one of the best in the entire series!

The story is admirably multi-layered — with the slider team having to deal with a ruthless oil company executive at a refinery at which the slider team has become employees.

Also, this happens while the team struggles to establish communications with a small sentient fire-being — a floating baseball-sized orb of fire which they accidentally brought to this world. Very Happy

Ya gotta love the irony, here. An oil refinery which has a small, intelligent ball of fire that wanders around in search of nutrients! Very Happy

And yet, this alien being is both intelligent and benevolent, and the slider team devises a way to communicate with it! The fire-being agrees not to injure the humans at the refinery, and Quinn promises to help it return to the parallel universe it came from!

In the episode's dramatic conclusion, Rembrant and Miss Wade Wells are trapped in a warehouse that the evil oil company exec has rigged to burn down so he can blame it on the striking union workers. Quinn and Arturo steal firefighter's equipment from a nearby truck to go in save their friends.

The fire-being shows up and helps them escape from the inferno unharmed!

The most amazing thing about that scene in the warehouse, when Rembrandt and Wade are in danger of being burned alive while Quinn and Arturo risked their lives to save them, is the many beautiful shots of the fire spreading throughout the building. These scenes are remarkably similar to the astounding photography in the climax of director Ron Howard's incredible movie, Backdraft (1991).

I was astounded by the fact that this episode of a weekly TV series was actually able to create the same mesmerizing environment inside that inferno — with countless shots of the strange, colorful, and beautiful patterns the fire made! Shocked

So, this episode had everything! Cool

~ It presents a brilliant plot about a "fire" life form who is accidentally brought to this Earth by the sliders.

~ It give us the valiant efforts by the scientist-heroes to establish communications with the intelligent being.

~ It includes a moral dilemma concerning the company executives who care nothing for the safety of their striking employees.

~ And it resolves this complex plot by exposing the evil executive's crimes while helping the fire-being return to its own universe when the sliders transport to the next world.

Admittedly the story is a bit vague on how this was done, but at this point in the episode I was completely willing to forgive this. We never find out how the fire-being can control its destination within the vortex that carries the team to random worlds, but apparently it had some way to exit the dimensional tunnel and return to it's home world while the slider team went on to some other universe.

All in all, this was an exceptional episode. Cool

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Pow
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2021 8:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So because I don't accept that there are alternate Earths out there, Bruce, that have the magic of Samantha Stevens or Jeannie I have the limited thinking of the idiotic FOX network executives.

I stand reproved.


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johnnybear
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 26, 2021 7:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If there are different earths out there and each one happens because each and every person here now or have been make different choices in their lives, then that makes for quite a few earths I'd say! Plus the various baddies like the Kromaggs that were from an earth where killer apes eliminated humanity means it goes way, way back too!
JB
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Bud Brewster
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 26, 2021 8:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

________________________________

I apologize, Mike. After re-reading my post I realized how rude and insulting it is! I don't know why I said that. Embarassed

Your reply, by the way, is downright classy. Your Jeannie/Samantha example certainly puts things into perspective. Sad

An infinite number of Earths doesn't mean everything will happen, it just means everything that can happen will happen.

Rather than edit my post above (which I was temped to do), I'll just let it stand and hope this apology will undo some of the damage.

Hey, I wonder if there's an Earth where the network executives are intelligent, imaginative, and artistic, instead of just money-hungry morons? Confused

Naaaa . . . Rolling Eyes

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Pow
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 26, 2021 6:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apology accepted Bruce.
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Pow
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2021 9:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dragonslide & potential "magical alternate Earths" reconsidered.

From Max Tegmark, M.I.T. mathematician & cosmologist.

A parallel universe could have nothing qualitatively new and different from our own universe.

A parallel universe could have totally different fundamental laws of physics from our universe.

A parallel universe could have the same fundamental laws of physics as ours, but could have started with different initial conditions.

A parallel universe could have the same fundamental laws of physics as our universe, but have different effective bylaws.

So Max does present a case where a parallel universe and Earth could possibly be ruled by fundamental laws of physics that could "appear to us like magic," even if it isn't magic per say.

I'll acknowledge that a Dragonslide Earth could pop up from time to time for the Sliders.

The same reasoning would also have to apply to Star Trek: The Animated show's "The Magiks of Magus-Tu."

Although I still contend that that episode of ST:TAS remains a low point for the show. Even if we accept that the beings from Magus-Tu can posses abilities that are contrary to our fundamental laws of physics; the plot remains overall quite unoriginal.

It borrows heavily from Star Trek: The Original Series episode "Who Mourns For Adonais."

Later on we see Captain Kirk gain magical-like abilities and defeats an inhabitant of the bizarre planet. So Kirk who has only recently gained these astonishing unfamiliar powers and has had no training whatsoever, is able to easily subdue someone who has grown up on the planet and had years to work with these abilities.

Sure.

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Pow
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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2022 10:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From Earthprime.

Sliders series co-creator & writer Tracy Torme talking about his episode "Invasion," one of his, and John Rhys-Davies favorite episodes from the series.

"I always wanted to do an episode that was steeped in traditional science fiction but couldn't due to network (FOX) resistance."

"The episode only happened because I went to the network head after attempting to get Invasion into production for a year."

"This episode was very important for the series for a number of reasons. No one at the network was sure that we could pull it off because it involved alien invaders, alien spaceships, CGI, and elaborate make-up on our limited budget. Our necks were really on the line to get it produced and to prove to them that we could do an out-and-out kind of science fiction show."

"The make-up team from The X-Files were fans of Sliders and came and designed the Kromaag make-up as a one-time shot just for us."

"John Rhys-Davies wrote notes to everyone that this is exactly the kind of episodes we should be doing."

"I screened Invasion for the new executive producer who said that this is exactly the kind of show we should not be doing."

"He had found it too dark; and had anti-family values. I realized then and there we weren't going to see Sliders in the same way."
_______________________________________________

Sidebar: Once again we have the oft told tale about how the network suits can ruin the marvelous vision of the creators of a SF TV show by thinking they know what's best.

This story happens time and time again.

In time, Torme would indeed walk away from his beloved creation due to increasing network interference.

I wonder just how many SF TV series we can actually list where the creators were pleased with the way the network let them have free rein with their show? That the network had their backs but left them alone to work their magic?

Far and few between I would imagine.

Tracy Torme also mentions that he envisioned the Kromagg home world as "having cities built into gigantic trees that make our redwoods look like match sticks."
_______________________________________________

Sidebar: Well with today's state of the art CGI supported by a handsome budget, just such a vision could be visually realized. Sounds awesome.

However, I did question if such gigantic trees were actually feasible on a earth-like planet? Would similar gravity like ours come into play for preventing such a thing? Are there other scientific issues that would also factor into the impossibility of such enormous trees?
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Bud Brewster
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PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2022 9:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pow wrote:
Tracy Torme also mentions that he envisioned the Kromagg home world as "having cities built into gigantic trees that make our redwoods look like match sticks."

However, I did question if such gigantic trees were actually feasible on a earth-like planet? Would similar gravity like ours come into play for preventing such a thing? Are there other scientific issues that would also factor into the impossibility of such enormous trees?

That's a great question, Mike! Very Happy

In Sail the Sea Stars I describe the planet Tason (pronouned Tas-ON) as having many features that defy scientific explain — such as the fact that it's a binary planetary system in which its "moon" (called Dante, as in Dante's Inferno, because it's totally volcanc) is the same size as Tason . . . even though the two planets are so close together that when Dante is viewed in the sky, it's the size of a dinner plate held at arms length! Shocked

Please note that Earth's Moon is the size of your pinky's fingernail held at arm's length. (Test my claim the next time you see a full moon.) Very Happy

~ Here are a few of the illustrations of Tason and Dante which I created for the novel when I posted part of it here on All Sci-Fi.






Also, the topography of Tason is astounding, with impossibly high cliffs and tall spires of rock which soar ten miles into the sky!









Plus there are no oceans — even though the planet has abundant water which somehow doesn't fill the areas of lowest elevation, the way it normally would.

The explanation for all these anomalies is revealed in the as-yet-unwritten sequel. The two planets were actually engineered by an ancient alien race who hid giant machines beneath the surface. These mechanisms distort the natural forces that would otherwise prevent the strange features from forming. Very Happy

It's another example of Arthur C. Clarke's statement which said, "Any science which is sufficiently advanced is indistinguishable from magic."

Perhaps the planet in Sliders which had the super-tall trees employed advanced technology like I described in StSoS. Cool

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Pow
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PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2022 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yet more fascinating concepts and pictures from the SF World of Bruce!

I did consider that these toweringly tall trees on Kromaag Prime were possibly the result of science.

What if the Kromaag's grafted their naturally occurring trees with some form of advanced genetic & highly sophisticated technology? That they were able to graft it all together and give birth to these phenomenally tall creations?

I've read articles that theorize that one day we will somehow & someway actually grow habitats utilizing nature and science and combining it all.

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Gord Green
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PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2022 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dante would not necessarily be called Tasons' "moon". Assuming it is about the same mass as Tason the two bodies would revolve around a common center of gravity.

That's true with the Earth/Moon system too. In our case the center of gravity is located on the Earth near the surface.

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Bud Brewster
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PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2022 4:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gord Green wrote:
Dante would not necessarily be called Tasons' "moon". Assuming it is about the same mass as Tason the two bodies would revolve around a common center of gravity.

That's true with the Earth/Moon system too. In our case the center of gravity is located on the Earth near the surface.

Absolutely correct, Gordon!

I referred to it as a "moon" only because in my novel it serves as the romantic object in the sky above the idealistic Tason during the starship crew's shore leave.

Read the novel and you'll understand.

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Is there no man on Earth who has the wisdom and innocence of a child?
~ The Space Children (1958)
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Pow
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2022 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just for fun I was imagining what it would have been like if our intrepid Sliders explorers encountered other famous television shows?

Quinn, the Professor, Wade, and Remy plunge through the vortex and into a rocky-desert region (think Vasquez Rocks) and land without too much pain in the soft sand. A man who was crouched among the rocks (hiding) is startled as our group lands some yards away from him.

Still, even under these surprising events, the man doesn't stand up to his full height. He is, understandably alarmed at the sight of these four strangers but even more so than you'd think. He's very frightened seeing them. "Who are you, where did you come from, how did you get her?," the man grimly asks them. The Sliders also notice that this gent holds a gun in his hand and it is pointing at them.

Quinn attempts to calmly explain as the rest of the group remain still with worried expressions on their faces. "Believe it or not, we've discovered a way to slide from one earth to a parallel earth. And there are numerous such earths we are finding." Remy jumps in and says, "What we aren't finding is our way back home . . . to OUR earth."

The man continues to eye them with suspicion while keeping his gun aimed at them. "That's one hell of a story," he says. "Then again, it may be just that, a cover story to hide your true intentions," the wary many continues.

"What intentions would those be, sir?," the Professor asks. "Well," it would have something to do with that," the man informs them as he points his head in the direction to the gorge below them all. The Sliders all look at once and gasp, below a spaceship is sitting quietly on the desert sands.

"My name is David Vincent and I think you are all Invaders!"
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